Feb. 13: Immigration legislation; Public education governance

In this Sunday Edition, lawmakers explain their proposals to change who's in charge of public schools. And two Utah senators talk about bills addressing illegal immigration.

Segment 1: Immigration legislation

The Utah Legislature enters the fourth week of its annual session on Feb. 14 and still has before it at least seven bills that address the difficult and often emotional issue of immigration.

Divisions over immigration policy have sparked protests on Capitol Hill and elsewhere in the state for a number of months, even the past few years. There are competing schools of thought on how to approach the issue, whether from the standpoint of enforcement only or with some accommodation that might include state-issued work permits. Those positions lie along one spectrum.

On another axis is the question of whether states should be involved at all, or leave enforcement and solutions to the federal government.

A few of these perspectives are discussed in this program. Sen. Luz Robles, D-Salt Lake City, and Sen. Stuart Reid, R-Ogden, explain their proposals.

Robles explains her worker permit bill, SB60. The bill, if passed, would require all adult undocumented immigrants to get a permit to work in the state.

"SB60 is a comprehensive approach to accountability, to public safety and to a mechanism to understanding and recognizing that we do have a population here that are out of immigration status -- 110,000 we believe, that's the estimate," Robles explains. "We want to know who they are, where they live, take them through criminal background checks and have them continue to be part of our community but be able to quantify their contributions and also have them integrate through English classes and civics classes."

The only privilege it gives is the ability to work legally.

"They won't have access to any program or benefits, not even unemployment insurance," says Robles. "They will pay into those programs and benefits, but will have no access to any of them."

Robles says the plan benefits law enforcement.

"It reduces the universe of potential criminal element within that community, because right now that potential criminal element could be any of those 110,000 people," she explains. "With this piece of legislation because we will have people go through criminal background checks and with that card permanently being with them, that means they already went through that process so law enforcement doesn't have to worry about that individual being a potential criminal."

Reid is sponsoring a resolution calling on Congress to act -- SJR9.

"My resolution acknowledges that the state government is very, very limited in what they can do in terms of immigration management," Reid describes. "And the reason I am doing it is because I want the electorate to know that while we are going to make every effort to try to put a comprehensive bill together, we have limited, limited authority, limited powers to do that. So the onus really belongs with Congress and in our case with our Congressional delegation. The electorate should be aware of that and should know that that's who they should be contacting and, frankly, putting pressure on, to come up with some legislation and move it through Congress so that these issues can be resolved."

"So my bill does something really simple, it acknowledges that we have limited authority, it identifies that Congress to date has failed in their authority to do something about immigration, it calls on Congress to correct their behavior and do something," Reid says. "Short of that, it then calls upon our congressional delegation to forward and advance legislation giving states the authority to manage immigration issues within their borders. So once the immigrant has crossed the national border, ends up within a state, then the states at that point can have the authority to manage an immigration issues that they are facing."

Reid is part of a coalition to move legislation through the Utah Senate and House regarding legislation, but he knows the federal government currently holds the authority to deal with immigration.

Segment 2: Public education governance

There are three proposals to change the governance of Utah's public schools.

Sen. Reid is sponsoring SJR9 which would amend the constitution to give the governor nearly exclusive executive control over the education system, virtually eliminating the State Board of Education.

Sen. Chris Buttars, R-West Jordan, is the sponsor of SJR1. This resolution would give the legislature statutory control over the school system, so lawmakers could essentially bypass the Board of Education by enacting specific laws.

And HB 264, sponsored by Rep. Carol Spackman Moss, R-Holladay, would allow for direct election of education board members in non-partisan elections.

Sen. Reid and Rep. Moss explain their proposals. Sen. Buttars declined our request for an interview.

Reid explains what power his resolution gives to the governor.

"It would give him authority under statute so there would be the balance of power between the governor and the Legislature, just like any other department in state government," describes Reid. "What my bill does is it allows the governor to do something that no single organization in education can do. We are siloed [sic] in education, we have the public ed, we have the ATCs and we have higher ed. And there is no authority that coordinates and brings those efforts together. It does a second thing -- it allows the governor to align those educational efforts with his economic development efforts, to create more prosperity for Utah. And the governor said that his cornerstone issue is education, in support of economic development. He has no way of doing that, he has no authority, do to anything with education at this point. Education is 60 percent of the budget and the CEO of the state, that we've elected to run the state, has no constitutional authority over 60 percent of the state budget. That doesn't make sense."

Moss believes giving the governor power takes away the will of the people.

"I think the direct election of school board members would reflect the public's keen interest in education and by putting the governor over that you take away the will of the people," she explains. "More than ever today there is more interest in public education, as resources have diminished, as times change and challenges increase, more and more people have a stake and an interest in public education."

She says the state school board has a significant impact on day-to-day operations of a classroom.

KSL Editorial

Electing members to the state board of education

Returning to direct board elections is attractive on a number of fronts. It has the support of the public education community, and enjoys bipartisan sponsorship.

"They have a huge impact. They have to implement decisions, many of them enacted by the state legislature," describes Moss. "The public has found out in some controversial issues, the school voucher issue being one, the state school board does have a big voice in policy and governance."

"There is much more accountability if it is their local community member and they have a chance to know what they want education to look like in their own community and they can enlarge that to the greater-education community," Moss says. "There is more accountability when people in your own community can inform others of what the issues are and get feedback."

Coming Up:

On Feb. 20, learn about a goal to increase the financial literacy of Utahns of all ages. KSL's Bruce Lindsay talks with a lawmaker and educator behind the plan.

Viewer response

Clint Spindler:I appreciate this focus being shared and discussed in a manner that can hopefully provide an ongoing public debate around how best to enhance our education system in a way that all constituents can be proud of. The thought of having top-down and/or bottom-up ideas and suggestions is a great place to begin this dialogue. Ultimately, however our system is reformed, I believe we need to have a person (or group) who is indeed truly responsible for the outcomes of our education system as Senator Reid mentioned. After everything is thoroughly discussed, ideas implemented, analysis and evaluation accomplished as to our goals, etc... there has to be a leader that is accountable for our progress or lack thereof. Also, I believe, as both guests mentioned today, that we need to focus discussion on the state agencies such as the Utah State Office of Education, the Legislature, the governor, and/or bringing on another level of oversight as was suggested by Senator Reid...an Education Commissioner. All of which are appropriate topics of discussion and may help to resolve specific concerns and issues on the State level. As Rep. Moss mentioned though, this by itself won't really be enough to move our education system forward in the direction it needs to go.

While it is important to have a fair process of electing/selecting state school board members (if we indeed do need a state board) and decide what these member's roles and responsibilities should or shouldn't be is paramount toward resolution and making progress with our system. If we are to make significant improvements with our education system, we must be more than a top-down system. Real local control and decision making is imperative if each community is going to achieve success with their own schools and student achievement. Simply having state leaders who mandate change does work. Committees composed for the purpose of "window-dressing" are frustrating and patronizing. To be both effective and successful, we must empower our local communities to accomplish this work. Top-down management in this area will not achieve our collective desired results for education reform.

I would like the dialogue being had statewide to take on another dimension as well. What if we changed the process of deciding how local school board members are elected/selected? Is how we are currently deciding our educational representation on local school boards truly as effective as it could be? I would like to see the following idea discussed in an open and transparent manner: As the purpose and goals of education have evolved over generations, have we thought about how to keep pace with these evolutionary changes? I am not sure we have really thought about how to go about revising the composition of local school boards in a manner that best meets each communities current educational needs. For example, the kinds of decisions local school boards need to make and the focus of how best to make these educational improvements are so complex. To help with this complexity, I wonder if we wouldn't be served by having members of the education family serving on our local school boards? Currently, practicing teachers are barred from serving on local school boards. I would suggest with this limitation... we are limiting how good we can really become. We are not tapping our best and most knowledgeable resources.

I agree there are many debatable issues related to this law, but honestly... who knows education best? And, are we truly using their skills, knowledge, and talents to best reform the system we say is essential to achieving the American Dream? If we truly want our education systems to improve and make meaningful reforms, it seems like we may need to look at how we can better use the expertise of our educators. Rethinking and possibly changing this law may offer a way to help move our reform process forward in a more collegial and effective manner. Just look at how the law and medical professions comprise their governing boards. Both of these professions use practicing and retired members to help guide and steer their profession. They also have seats on their boards for community members to serve as well. Is it the right time to look at this kind of change for our education system?

It truly takes a village, rather than short-sighted mandates to tackle this complicated and essential work. While this may seem like a fairly radical idea because we have not gone about business this way in the education arena ever before, I would hope others may see some wisdom in this kind of configuration of local school boards. By having a well-rounded local school board -- all who have the passion to help the education system be the best it can be will be offered a seat at the table. And, in-turn, we may see some real, committed, and lasting efforts that can be sustained in a way that truly revolutionizes our school systems. Consensual buy-in from all stakeholders is crucial. We have the will, skills, and knowledge to accomplish this monumental challenge. But, do we have the grass-roots will and the established leadership needed to go about this reform process in the most effective way? To me, that is the million-dollar question! Or will it simply be more of the same, state leaders running in circles trying to implement mandates that have historically proven ineffective in providing the meaningful kinds of reform that all of us wish to see happen.

Chad Lyman:In my opinion the business community should be held accountable for the illegal immigrants coming to this country. Millions of taxpayers are subsidizing these businesses to essentially carry out a modernized form of slavery. These businesses are suppressing the true economy, therefore undercutting a raise in pay for many Americans that would do the job.

It's bothersome when I hear that Americans won't do these jobs. The reason Americans won't do the job is that the cost/benefit has been undercut by the greed of business owners. If the business plan can't survive on its own without the help of modern slavery (illegal immigration) then the business needs to changes its business plan, or go out of business.

I am tired of supporting business that subsidizes their cheep labor cravings with our tax dollars. Illegal immigrants come to America to earn more money and improve their prosperity. It's not likely that they are coming to the United States to be a U.S. citizen.

It bothers me that so much time is spent vilifying illegal immigrants. If you were able to earn more, of course you would come to the U.S. So in my opinion hold business owners accountable for illegal immigration.