I'd like to see Wyoming get #6 and become bowl eligible.

@grammar police - I won't take it personally. :-)

@grammar police - Then you shouldn't have replied to budwa. Funny that even KSL put BYU at #3 - I about fell off my chair.

@grammar police - Embarassing wins aside, I'd definitely have them tied at #2.

@Dave P. - I believe BYU will finish #2 in the MWC. They definitely have the talent to beat AFA, yet they must play well. I will be there with the fam and hopefully the weather will be good.

BYU will squeak by Utah, and thats about all I can say about that...

Say what you want about the Las Vegas bowl, I've been there, done that, but it is a million dollar payout.

OF course a BCS bowl is about 17 million...

@budwa - They banned my account for pointing out that all of the other polls in the country have BYU ranked well above Utah. Get used to my new name.

@Grammar Gestapo - Now it's time for me to vote up all of my other posts with this new account...

@Grammar Gestapo - The BCS poll, you know the only one that counts has Utah ahead of BYU.

@budwa - i dont understnand why byu is below utah. that is totaly rediculus. i guess i can understand why pple would put tcu above byu this year even thouh historicly byu is the better team. but to have utah above byu is a very bad jugement. i always thougt that ksl was pro byu but now i know they have been infected by utah fans.

@BYUquest4perfection - well lets see who has the best record then who has the wider margin of victory that would be why BYU is a weak 3rd so take off your punch goggles and start viewing reality again

@jdozer2000 - BYU and UTAH both have exactly the same record right now at 8-2 (5-1 in conference). Going by that stat, they should be tied for #2 in the conference right now (this is where I think they should).

Moving to your next "stat" of margin of victory, there's absolutely no way you can say that BYU is third. Let me start by saying that I believe that comparing margin of victory between teams can be fun but is pretty meaningless because different teams simply play better (or worse) against different opponents, and even the best teams can have a bad day. However, since you said that it should be used to determine rankings, here are some stats for you:

Total margin of victory for all opponents including wins and losses:
BYU 353-216 (average margin 13.7 points per game)
UTAH 290-203 (average margin 8.7 points per game)

Total margin of victory for all opponents (wins only):
BYU 318-124 (average margin 24.25 points per game)
UTAH 238-117 (average margin 15.13 points per game)

Total margin of victory for common opponents including wins and losses:
BYU 219-118 (average margin 14.14 points per game)
UTAH 189-128 (average margin 8.71 points per game)

Total margin of victory for common opponents (wins only):
BYU 212-80 (average margin 26.4 points per game)
UTAH 161-73 (average margin 17.6 points per game)

I guess I'm missing something, but I don't see how you could possibly use margin of victory in any way (unless you selectively pick the one game -UNM- from the whole season where Utah had a significantly better margin of victory) to say that Utah is ranked higher than BYU right now.

BYU had a bad game last Saturday and didn't win as easily as they should have. But if you want to say that the ONE bad game makes them worse than Utah, then you also have to say that Utah's FOUR "squeaker" wins would then put them well behind BYU. Both arguments are stupid and irrelevant. Right now, the only thing that matters is overall record and conference record. In those stats, BYU and UTAH are tied at #2. However, since the KSL poll system apparently doesn't allow for a tie, Utah is at #2 and BYU is at #3 simply because Utah was ahead last week and BYU didn't do anything to put them clearly ahead of Utah this week.

By the way, what type of goggles do you wear that not only prevent you from seeing reality, but that create a completely different reality where you can say that margin of victory puts Utah definitely ahead of BYU?

@BYUquest4perfection - You’re not fooling anyone you imbecile.
We all – except for a few retards – know you are really a Ute fan.

@20X - Hey 20X Don't say the "R" word!

@BYUquest4perfection - byuquest.....

are you a graduate of the famproc school of spelling....

just wondering.....

go falcons....

@BYUquest4perfection - the power poll has nothing to do with historical its in the now not back in 1984

Bull shiz.. Utah has had embarrassing wins this whole season. BYU and Utah Should be tied for 2nd place.

@Activeliving - That will be answered soon enough.

@budwa - Yeah I guess it doesn't matter until BYU proves themselves against AFA. The holy war will be crazy this year. Both BYU and Utah are well matched. I see BYU winning though by 2 TD's and a field goal.

@Activeliving - I predict 34-31 for Utah.

@Dave P. - that is a dum thing to say. you realy think utah can beat byu? there is no way in heaven or earth that will hapen. look at the games aganst tcu and wyoming. byu did much beter than utah in both those games. you need to go look at your history and you will see that byu is the team that will win this game by a bunch of points. max hall will make 6 tuchdowns and unga will run for 6 as well. my prediction is byu 55 and utah 0! thats right 000000!

@BYUquest4perfection - byuquest.....


is a tuchdown wen you get the bal ento the ennd zon...

just wondering....

go falcons...

@BYUquest4perfection - Did you forget the game is in Provo this year. Of course Utah will win. The final score will be 54-28 or 38-7.

@BYUquest4perfection - How did TDS do better than Utah against TCU? TDS lost by 31 AT HOME! Utah lost by 27 on the road. Wyoming was a bad game for the Utes, but what about TDS game against New Mexico? Your argument is idiotic. The only 6 touchdowns Max Hall will throw will be to the Utes again. It will be a repeat of last year.

@BYUquest4perfection - dont ya mean max hall 6 ints. one to a guy named kruger,unga will have a good game no doubt but max hall will wilt under pressure

@Activeliving - Not me. I see BYU jumping up by around 10-13 by half time, and then attempting to hold off Utah in the second half. I initially predicted BYU by 10, but their defense is really showing some vulnerability to even average speed in the flat.
They just don't have the speed, even in a zone.

Utah will have it's work cut out for them, but I think it's a toss up...especially seeing how BYU performed against New Mexico. I attributed a slow lack-luster appearance to Utah's defense early in the year, which has gotten better. BYU appears to have actually slowed throughout the season.

@Activeliving - activeliving......

if you see bywho winning by two td's..... man you ought to get those glasses cleaned.....and don't drive until you do....

hope this helps....

@deanofmean - real class act who has to use stupid words and can't simply say the name of the other school. all that "tds" or "bywho" stuff shows your maturity level.

to the byu fans i also think it is dumb when you say "yewts".

@Ihateutah - question is......


when do we see yours fool....

@Activeliving - Maybe they should be tied for second place. I don't know. Either way both of them were blown away by TCU. The difference is that the Ute's offense managed to score more on the TCU defense with a freshmen who is still learning how Div 1 football works. TCU gave him a great lesson. I see a promising future for him and the Utes. For those Cougar fans who are offended about this poll stating the Cougars had an embarrassing win just let it go. New Mexico's kicker handed BYU the win otherwise the Lobos could have won. BYU got lucky but they won. They Utes have been lucky a few times too. This is just a poll anyway. The real fight for second place will start after this week. Don't forget about Air Force Cougars or the fight for second might not be between the Utes and Cougars. They aren't a team to be taken lightly.

GO UTES!!! I am looking forward to the rest of the season win or lose I will still cheer them on.

@Tortuga 17 - funny how you mention that the difference was ute's offense managed to score more on tcu. what about the difference that tcu's offense also scored 27 more points on utah than they did on byu? if you bring up one side you have to look at the whole story.

tcu stomped both utah and byu--there are no bright sides for either team from those games. it all will come down to the holy war.

@Ihateutah - oops I guess you are right. But I do think there are some bright sides from the game. Wynn did not have a flawless game. He wasnt even close to that but he seemed very mature as a QB and for the most part was able to keep calm. He is just a freshman and the bright side I see in the game is that he has a bright future. He had some really good plays will be a lot better after this game. I agree with you though that any talk about who is better between Utah and BYU doesnt really mean anything until they play each other.

@Tortuga 17 - and even after Utah and BYU play each other, no matter what happens Utah fans will still love the UTes and think they are the greatest and BYU fans will still love the Cougars and think they are the greatest. It is always great to support your team whether they win or lose. It should be a fun game on the 28th. The only thing at stake is bragging rights for the next year. No pressure. No worries. Just great football.

@Tortuga 17 - I could not agree more. Well said.

@Tortuga 17 - agreed

@Tortuga 17 - Couldn't agree more. You stick with your team win or lose!

@Tortuga 17 - Finally a respectable Ute fan. I agree with you. Utes and BYU are well matched. Will be a great game.

I just earned alot of respect back for KSL! Go Utes!

@William T. - william t.....

i loved what they said about the cougars..... priceless.....

wtg ksl...

go falcons.....

@deanofmean - «no swearing please»!! I couldn't stop laughing!!

It's like some mad BYU fan is doing the polls!

Nobody forget...1984

@daviskid80 - Or...1944

@daviskid80 - How could we? We are reminded once a week.

@daviskid80 - Totally! I was four years old growing up in Magna attending Pre-School. Dang, those girls were HOT!

@daviskid80 - what happened in 1984......

@deanofmean - Go ask a BYU fan...

@youdontknowme - i don't know any....

@deanofmean - Dude, Ghostbusters came out in 1984! How could you forget! For shame!

@William T. - silly me william t.....


i thought they were referring to the year that bo-didley-tech won the national championship....

but hey.....gotta love star wars....

go falcons....

@William T. - Yeah, remember the year the falcons won it all? Oh wait, that's right, they haven't even come close.

@youdontknowme - We all remember 2004/05 and 2008/09 beyond that I think we can only remember six (6*) conference championships in fifty one (51) years. But hey, the Ute’s need something to remember. Even if it is only eight (8*) things for fifty one (51) years worth of football.
Go Ute’s!

@20X - Come on really?

Utahs 26 Conference champions over BYUs 23..

Utahs 600 wins over BYUs 500.

Utahs 11-3 bowl wins over BYUs 9-17-1

Utahs 2 BCS bowls in the last decade over BYUs NC in 1984.

Not trying to be rude here, but why must you point out everything bad about Utah? Utah and BYU are both good teams and have had great success! Quit being a troll.

@Jamaicachicken - Sorry... I'll try to be nicer in the future...
I didn’t realize Utah had so many good years, of course I was just looking at the last fifty one (51) years with all of Utah’s six (6*) conference championships and the lack of quality teams they were bad enough to play by winning just enough games to qualify for the Bowl Games they played in… except for the two (2) years 04/05 and 08/09.

I remember once BYU beat K State in the Cotton Bowl and finished like 5th in the country. Does that count? It was after 1984 but before the BSC, so does that count?

@Jamaicachicken - Plus, BYU has won twenty three (23) conference championships in forty four (44) years.
I'm just saying...

@Jamaicachicken - Well said!

@20X - How many undefeated years does YBU have? That cotton bowl was not an undefeated year so no it does not count!

@William T. - Your right... what was I thinking?

They only had 14 wins 1 loss.

At least they got the NCAA record for most wins in a single season even if it didn't count.

I'm sorry for my lack of knowledge of the NCAA bowl thing.

@William T. - "You're" Right.

Sorry for the spelling. I can’t get anything right today.

@20X - 20X, Utah and BYU both have quality programs with GREAT tradition! I was just trying to get your goat. November 28th will be a great game that will add even more to these programs tradition!

@William T. - Ditto...

@deanofmean - Van Halen?

@budwa - Your really funny today...

@deanofmean - My Little League baseball team and soocer team both won championships in 1984. It was a good year!

It was probably just a ute fan trying to rile people up. 99.9% of BYU don't think that way.

@Intentional Torts - 99.9 % of BYU people don't think anyway. Remember 1984!!

Im sure Bronco will have BYU pumped up for the holy war, since he is so full of enthusiasm.
Go Utes!!!!

@JONNYFIVE - Yeah, but Bill Belichick doesn't get pumped up either and he is an amazing coach (even after that stupid, stupid, stupid call Sunday).

@Intentional Torts - That's because Bill Belichick cheats

@Butters Durst - Don't get me wrong, I am a Colts fan all the way through! I was so incredibly happy when the Pats failed on 4 and 2. Belichick was stupid to cheat because he didn't need to. Despite those things, I still have to acknowledge that he has a great football mind and has made some amazing teams. LaVell Edwards is another example. Mike Holmgren another.

I really hope TCU doesnt get cheated and they get a chance to play for the National Championship. Based on how they have played this year I feel like they can beat anyone.

@Tortuga 17 - Definitely, but Texas has to lose in order for TCU to play in the championship. They will never give it to TCU over Texas. Here's to hoping for a better system in the future.

@Tortuga 17 - what intentional torts said.

i think the utes are ahead of byu in this poll is because byu almost laid an egg against a team that is now 0-10.

I don't really care who wins on the 28th I just hope it is a great game and none of the players or fans get hurt!

Both are great schools and have great strengths, that being said, I really do believe some of the fans from both schools could use a lobotomy.

@Spectre 47 - spectre.....


i would ten time rather have a bottle in front of me...


than a frontal lobotomy.....

go falcons....

@deanofmean - SDSU, SDSU, SDSU!!!!!

@sklater - in ur dreams little boy..... in your dreams....


but hey, santa is almost here....

go falcons....

@deanofmean - Your dreaming of a little boy?

Air Force will be a tough battle for BYU. I honestly do not know which team will win that game. I'm hoping that BYU wins so that they will carry over a BCS ranking to the Utah game. As far as the TCU-Utah game - Utah played horrible run defense and special teams, had several fumbles, a blocked punt, fumbles, a pick 6, and over 100 yards of penalties. If you look at the 1st and 2nd quarters of the game, you can see that TCU's TD's were given as a gift to them. So, their 55 points might as well have been against no defense or the worst Utah defense since 1990. Utah had a bad night. On the positive side, the offense put up 4 touchdowns, the most against TCU this year. I expect that Utah will learn from their mistakes and be ready for the next 2 games. I think that the Utah-BYU game will be close as it is every year. I don't see either team dominating the game.

@GoUtesGoUtesGoUtes - Well, the Utah/BYU game wasn't close last year. :)

Oh, by the way, Wyoming will be David over Goliath in a showy, snowy Laramie Saturday. I love those Wyoming games in a total whiteout. Go Cowboys!

Wow, there are 4 teams from the PAC 10 with 3 losses in the top 25... Am I missing something here?
Oregon barely escapes Utah, yet with 2 losses, they're still ranked 11th.

I think Clemson should be ranked higher than Stanford, USC, and Oregon State. In that case, it should help bump TCU past Texas.

Save some of the BYU-Utah talk for next week. BYU is playing a tough defense this week and SDSU is trying to become bowl eligible. Both oponents will be looking to win since neither BYU nor Utah was impressive last week.

Slow day for football chat. Everyone must be in line for the new burger joint.