Why dont they just say they couldnt prove it instead of CLEARED

@MyOpinion4U - I agree. Cleared of criminal wrongdoing does not necessarily mean completely innocent.

@MyOpinion4U - Much as I don't like it, maybe they did prove that he didn't do anything criminally wrong. That doesn't mean he didn't do anything morally wrong, but they certainly could have actually cleared him of criminal wrongdoing.

I'm also curious about the statement "he seemed to pick girls that would turn 18 their senior year." Um, don't the vast majority of students turn 18 during their senior year? Wouldn't it be expected that with a sample size as small as 6 that the likelihood that all 6 would turn 18 their senior year be fairly high? I'm not sure if they simply don't know how to write well enough to convey a different meaning, don't understand statistics, or what, but that is a very useless and somewhat misleading statement.

The guy apparently did nothing criminal, so we can't prosecute him. But let's have the school district send a strong message that any type of inappropriate teacher/student relationships are completely inexcusable, and punish accordingly.

@MyOpinion4U - Warren Jeffs should have read this pedophiles rule book...

@MyOpinion4U - EXCOMMUNICATE HIM ANYWAY!

@MyOpinion4U - Hey Rise of the Emporer,

Again I ask, excommunicate him from what??? This is really getting old. Use clarity when you post.

@MyOpinion4U - I wouldn't expect much Ben D.

He's a hater.

@MyOpinion4U - Mr. Neo.
You got this exactly right.

Except for the following:
The state detectives that issued a public statement that this man had "inappropriate" relations with students are out of line and have stepped out of a legal statement and into a moral one. The state and state officials have no moral authority and need to keep their mouths shut on this kind of matter.

I also have moral issues with what this guy did, but a state employee using a state-sponsored podium in his official capacity to slander a citizen in the press is wrong. He should get a lawyer and sue the state and the detectives for slander.

My Mother always wanted me to be a teacher. She would always point out the state benefits, steady pay and access to hawt girls.

This person is getting off with a technicality. Seriously I wouldn't want to keep a teacher around who is targeting the girls that turn 18 their senior year. They are still students and he is still the teacher.

@Serenity_May - Yeah... he was careful not be engage in ILLEGAL relationships, but he certainly used a position of power and trust to take advantage of kids. The only reason I can think that the district should keep him is if there is no written policy to fire him. In any case, his reputation should be communicated to all students going forward so he can't get away with it again.

@Serenity_May - That's not a technicality! If he didn't actually have any sexual contact until they were 18 and out of school then he didn't break a law. Inappropriate yes, illegal no!

@Serenity_May - PD:
Apparently he already had a reputation because other students knew. Looks like that information didn't stop other girls for falling for his lines of BS. Our society raises too many perverts and stupid kids!

@Serenity_May - He was one of those teachers that became close to many stuidents, male and female.

He seemed to help out those that struggled by paying close attention and spending extra time with them. Those that excelled he also paid close attention to by helping them to do better and do great things once they graduate.

From what I have ben reading, It wasn't until an anonymous caller to the Standard Examiner did they investigate this. Probably an ex or something. Now all these other people who knew him and were close start thinking "I wonder if he was trying to be a good teacher and close to me or just trying to sleep with me?". So they went to the police with their story.

Why is it that Hollywood and Americans love movies about teachers who take students under their wing and go above and beyond? But in real life teachers are afraid to do this because the news has sensationalized it and the police call things innapropriate which may not be at all.

@Serenity_May - While I in no way condone what he is doing and think the District should fire him on the spot, 18 yr. old girls know better and should bare some of the responsibility. What is wrong with the parents? Where is their hugh and cry?

@Serenity_May - Technicality.......or opportunity! And besides what is the big deal, he was 18 once, yes it was 29 years ago but still.

@Serenity_May - Technically they are legal, its sad...really! Where are the fathers of these kids. I have a daughter and let a teacher...I got this thing called I BEAT A MAN syndrome when it come to my daughter and any guy let alone some teacher.

@Serenity_May - The guy violated his "code of ethics" with the teaching profession. The school board has plenty of justification to kick his butt out. The problem is that the school system lets these unethical teachers just fester in the school system. I can't believe the GOOD teachers would allow these scumbags to continue to work side by side with them. It makes the whole school sytem of Utah a joke. I live in Nevada and we all talk about the Utah teachers...It truly is a UTAH thing..

Why don't they just say he was CLEARED and leave it at that? Inappropriate relationships are not the cops' business until the relationships become criminal. The cops don't need to be running around telling people they are inappropriate.

@Al_Tenuta - this whole investigation was biased. The investigating officer seemed to base his idea on his on moral beliefs and not on the letter of the law as he is supposed to.

Who is he to say what it inappropriate? That is his belief and being an employee of the city shoudl not be speaking his opinion on matters as it reflects on the city.

If someone is investigated for stealing beer but later found to not have stolen the beer can an officer say the person was still acting inapropriately if taht officer belived that purchasing and consuming alcohol is wrong according to his own personal beliefs or religious viewpoint?

@Al_Tenuta - Biased?? How do you know that??? With all the cases in the news recently if there was ACTUAL criminal conduct there would be charges! They interviewed many girls from his past and obviously none of them had sex when they were minors or he would be in jail!
A person can be jailed with just the allegation, so it looks like it didn't happen.
Learn how the law works please.

@Al_Tenuta - utah_guy you apparently don't have any daughters.

@Al_Tenuta - What really needs to happen is the schools need to have a very CLEAR definition of what is appropriate and inappropriate for teachers an students to engage in. That way when issues arise they can get rid of these kind of teachers. You are right he did nothing illegal, but the school needs to define inappropriate and have CLEAR punishments for acts such as these, like termination.

Mr Al-Tenuta:
It seems you are saying the police should only react if a crime has been committed... I DISAGREE. I think inappropriate things or suspicious activities should be investigated, as they are, to prevent crimes or further criminal acts.

I would rather they investigate and be wrong, then wait until something terrible happens...

maybe some quality time with one of the victims fathers would cause this pervert to seek other employment.If it was my daughter he would be using his health insurance more often then most teachers.

@CalifBoy - Then you would be in jail for assault!

@CalifBoy - yes, but any good father would take that little slap on the hand.

@CalifBoy - Thats about the time DFS gets involved.

@CalifBoy - Maybe the fathers weren't spending quality time with their daughters. Not excusing him by any means but there were reasons these young ladies were vulnerable.

If you are going to state that he is cleared of wrongdoing, then there is no need to state he had inappropriate relationships. Kind of a contradiction, don't ya think?

@Ed D. - I think it's pretty clear... he was cleared of any legal wrongdoing, but I think by any reasonable ethical standards the relationships would be considered inappropriate. I'm pretty liberal minded and I don't see a problem with a 20 or 25 year age difference in a sexual relationship between consenting adults, but this guy was using his position to take advantage of kids... and he was very calculated and methodical if he made sure they were all of age.

@Ed D. - Who is going to punish these Lolitas?

@Ed D. - no not really. inappropriate simply means beyond what a reasonable person would call within "society acceptable norms". Which basically means 8 out of 10 people would find the relationship harming standards of life. I'm sure if you observed the couple walking down the street you would have something to say (in your mind to yourself) about them. Either he must be rich, or what a pervert.

It's also amazing some people believe because she is 18 she should have known better, or blame it on the parents for not preparing her for the situation. I wish there was a magic number which automatilcally gave each child wisdom, intellect and the ability to analyze any situation they might find themsleves in.

But in reality that is not the case, a person lacking life experience (like a 17-18 year old girl) who if you remember the first article does not have a Father in her life; could easily be manipulated. The fault her lies not with her mother or herself but with the Teacher. He was placed in a position of confidence, yes criminally probable cause could not be determined, ethically he is guilty.

@Ed D. - No father figure? You must be confusing this with another story. her parents are married and have always been so.

The picture of Ogden High in the article makes the school look really nice... That's the only interesting thing that came out of this story to me.

Whether the teacher was cleared of criminal wrongdoing, he should still be guilty of the ethical wrongdoing. It sounds like he became a teacher to get a date. I have a 12 year old daughter, who will a senior when she is 18 and I would be absolutely livid if she was dating her teacher. Shame on him, he is supposed to be a person these teens can look up to, not hook up with on their 18th birthday.

@KAYA62003 - If your daughter is dating a teach at age 17 or 18, YOU the parent should take some blame and responsibility.

@KAYA62003 - Zablde- So basically in a nutshell you are saying, because the teenage girls are going out with their teacher, it is the fault of the parents'? I have heard some whoppers in my day, but that takes the cake. The blame is a teacher who is attempting to date 18 year old students. I think your comment is a cop out. I do not blame the student or the parents of the student, i blame the teacher. Young girls are very impressionable and the 47 year old man should not treat a High School as a dating ground. I do not care if you agree with me.

"Inappropriate" and "illegal" are two totally different things. The police investigation deal with legal matters. So, when the police claim he was "cleared", that only refers to illegal behavior. Socializing with and speaking to a teenager is not illegal.

On the other hand, the school district is investigating if the teacher did anything "inappropriate" based upon their criteria and standards. If they find there was inappropriate behavior, the teacher can be disciplined or fired depending upon the severity.

The only problem is that "inappropriate" is subjective and there are a lot of gray areas involved and each district has different criteria for defining "inappropriate". So, it becomes quite messy and inconsistently applied.

Does anyone know what the teachers name is?

@Bossy - yeah

@Bossy - I for one, am glad that that KSL, for ONCE, did not print the teacher's name because regardless of the outcome of the investigation by either the police or school administration, the man's future and career would be GONE. The court of public opinion would convict him and then pursuade the administration to do the same.

Once the investigation is complete and the admin finds him guilty of inappropriateness or whatever, he then takes his medicine. As well, if they find him not-guilty, he will continue his life. I have seen a lot of people's lives tarnished, including mine, for being on the wrong side of public opinion...before the justice system gets a chance to work. And a lot of times on allegations.

And to those who say that the justice system doesn't work, I can guarantee that NONE of you have done anything about it in terms of ousting judges, speaking to representatives to change laws or any of the other processes needed to change the status quo.

And I rarely do this but THANKS KSL, for NOT printing the teacher's name.

And yes...I have daughters. You are free to TROLL me now perched atop your high chairs.

Okay, stupid observation, but aren't most students turning 18 around their senior year? I know I went to high school in Utah, but I am pretty sure that the math works! So does that mean that the educator targets all GIRLS that are seniors?

@Saint Georger Observer - No...just the cute ones.

@Saint Georger Observer - Some may turn 18 the summer after they graduate.

Pink Floyd said it best

"HEY TEACHER, LEAVE THEM KIDS ALONE!"

There is at least one teacher in ever high School right now who thinks he/she is above the law or won't get caught. Wait till next week and it will be news!

Hey teacher, you will get caught and you will lose! The world is watching you!

@carnivorous - I pretty sure "The Wall" wasn't about a student/teacher affair.

@carnivorous - Maybe it was more like the Police song?

Don't stand
Don't stand so
Don't stand so close to me

Nah.

@carnivorous - Carnivorous, loved your comment! Laughed out loud. Made me want to dig out my Pink Floyd. This whole story makes me think PF had it right all along. "WE DON"T NEED NO EDUCATION."

So does that mean he won't be excommunicated and maybe just disfellowshiped?

i know i wouldnt want my high school teacher hitting on me knowing that i was 18 and it wasnt illegal anymore for him to date. thats just wrong and uncomftorable.

He's lucky, he ages, but his girlfriends are always 18 ! :)

what ever happened to just giving your teacher an apple... this stuff gives a whole new meaning to sucking up to your teacher

@Thomas d - Ewwwww... nasty!

Why do the school systems continue to put these cases on the backs of law enforcement? The teacher has broken "ethical" and "code of conduct" rules. Get rid of him. A teacher shouldn't have to be proven to be a "mass-murderer" before they are booted out!

Plenty of justification to get rid of teachers like this. Don't put it on the shoulders of law enforcement.

@trytorelax - What makes these parents anymore level headed or unbiased than the police? I agree it shouldn't go to the police but most school boards are parents and they fly off the handle way to much.

@trytorelax - No one tries to take care of these ethics problems internally because that is just not as sensational as taking it to law enforcement. Crimes have victims, but ethical violations do not. We are a culture of victims. Rule #7 of the Suburban Survival Manual: Never pass up an opportunity to create an overblown melodrama.

Thomas d you made me giggle and shoot chocolate out my nose onto my trousers!

Why would you put off topic when i asked if anyone knew his name? I went to OHS long ago and wanted to know if they were there when i was.

@Bossy - You are justified with that knowledge but not on this site. If others find out his name it could get worse for this teacher or students. Have you read half of the comments by the nut jobs on this site. It is best left unsaid.

@Bossy - I'm sure SOMEONE knows his name.

Seems like a lot of rumoring going on here. Perhaps KSL should refrain from GOSSIP!

@Jon B. - I heard Jon B. was caught dating this teacher!

Utah_guy:

Having personal insight into this case I can tell you, you are wrong.

The officer did all that could be done to try and make criminal connections. Once it became obvious that the connection was not going to be the case was closed.

The police don't write the criminal statutes. Here is an example. The law states that if a person who is 17 has a relationship with an adult who is more than 10 years older it is unlawful, unlawful if their is sexual contact that consisted of touching underneath the clothing. So they don't have intercourse, they make out, they hug, touch eachother on top of clothing (not skin to skin), then their is not much the police can do.

If the relationship this teacher had (as innappropriate) as it was did not reveal criminal conduct then the officer has no case.

@freedomsnotfree - Are you saying that he was making out with underage girls, or is that merely conjecture?

@freedomsnotfree - You say: "The officer did all that could be done to try and make criminal connections".

That IS the problem. He tried making connections that just aren't true.

He should not do all he can to make criminal connections, as he did. He should do all he can to get the truth and uphold the law. If the truth is he did nothing wrong he should shut up, case closed. Don't drag this guy threw the mud because fo personal beliefs of right and wrong. That also hurts his family, the girl, the school and community's reputations, etc...

If their is no case he should shut his mouth and do his job by moving onto the next case.

The article is quite sketchy rendering few details. Utah_Guy seems to have a more informed perspective. It's a good thing that this teacher did not break the law. Leave it to some cop to accuse him of being inappropriate. Could it be that the cop wants some action himself? Just sayin'.

The old horny man should just get fired , how many parents would want their kid to bring home an old limp perverted teacher ! What would they have in common ? The teacher is getting paid still ! What a joke !

@baker123 - your a joke. People like you that dont know whats going on adding in your 2 cents. He should be getting paid until they prove their was wrongdoing. If every teacher just got canned for every accusation before a full investigation was done well their wouldnt be many teachers left. Thanks for judging! Theres plenty just like you. Looser

@baker123 - Now that brings up the question, 'How would you know if he were an "old limp perverted teacher?"'

@baker123 - I guess six counts arent enough , how many more will it take ? Well I guess atleast we can reward him and pay him even though he wasnt concentrated on his job and just staring at teenage girls ! That will be highly effective ! loo zer !

Absolute bullshi! Their contemplating bringing him back. If they dont I would sue them bigtime. He was cleared!! Gaurenteed they wont bring him back, its a right to work state and they will find some miniscule thing in his file to justify not rehiring him. What a crock of crap.


"The teacher, whose name was not released, remains on paid administrative leave as school district officials decide whether to take disciplinary action."

@Arizona F. - Teachers sign a "code of conduct" document that includes behaviors that are not illegal, but considered "inappropriate" based upon community standards. Although the teacher was "cleared" of illegal activity, he might still have violated the "code of conduct" document that he signed as part of the job.

For example: A teacher wearing a speedo swimsuit is not breaking the law, but wearing such clothing to the school job would be a violation of the "code of conduct" for dress and appearance and the teacher could be disciplined or dismissed.

@Arizona F. - Granite District lets students wear pant waists below the crotch with only thread-bare underwear to temporarily prevent exposure so that bare cracks spread disease on classroom chairs. Even the students who sit behind them don't seem to mind. Why can't teachers wear the same styles?

/sarcasm

I think that they should release his name. He deserves to be put in the public eye for doing what he's done. Agree or disagree with his actions is beside the point. Release his name so that when he's put back to work, like he probably will, parents can warn their daughters of him. Do you really think he won't do this again?

@DodgerFan - There is a lot of vitriol on this board that is not justified by the article. He will do what again, specifically?

yeah ! lets bring him back so he can try to persuade other young girls to have a relationship with him ! There is no justifcation for an old geezer trying to get it on with many teenager girls !

@baker123 - Absolutely, because 18+ yo girls should not be able to make decisions for themselves, and young guys should not feel so much competition from these old geezers who can't satisfy these 18+ girls anyway.

Young guys are so sensitive to the needs of others, drive around in expensive cars, own their own home, and just have $millions to spend on these 18+ girls, what young 18+ girl would want to hang around on "old limp geezer" anyway?

/sarcasm

He is still a predator checking out your daughters.

@Frank A. - Don't let them outside because there are thousands, if not millions, of predators running around loose.

DodgerFan, baker123, and Frank A. you all failed the bias test. What if he didn't do it? What if he did and this situation has changed him? What if he is a rocking hot old guy and it looks like its his fault but its not?

At least he was keeping it legal and going after the soon to be 18 year olds. My money says they only talked never had sex or anything until they did turn 18.

Come on people get off your judgmental pedestals you know allot of those "SEXY" 18 year olds are HOTT ready to rock a guys world Just go to the mall folks they are all over they look HOTT so don't sit here and say you have no desire for a HOTT SEXY" 18 year old you are wrong you just don't have what it takes to get her you are a LOSER. Them 18 year olds will romp your world behind closed doors.

@Jimmy The Great - i dont think they want your old soggy balls !

In Utah it's "deemed inappropriate " illegal for older males to talk to and make friends with girls under the age of 21, actually any age,

what more can you get from a person that goes to Ogden High i mean come on

@Broc F - Broc F....Spence Eccles graduated from Ogden High

Other famous alumni at Ogden High include Lt. Gov. Greg Bell, Brent Scowcroft, a former national security
adviser to several presidents; former Salt Lake City Mayor Rocky Anderson; Black & Decker CEO Nolan Anderson; and Zions Bank Vice President Fred Ball....shall I go on....?

Good for him, he waited until they were considered concenting adults! What an idiot, he sould still be fired!

The teacher sounds like one of those smart predators. He picks them out just before they turn 18 and then waits for his chance.

You would think the state board of education could come up with a screening tool they could use during the interview process and weed out these undesirable types. After all they are smart because they are educators.

@geezer daddy - Well said !

Whew! That was a close call.

sk8nut < So if he did you would feel ok with it huh ! Lets put a some candy in front of a kid and see what happens , pretty obvious ! Parents have a hard enough time keeping their children safe , why should they worry about an old perverted man at school!