I hope this registry includes the 200 or so lewd homosexual activists who marched on Temple Square They are equally offensive. It seems like about 40% of our society has become predators to society. They are by far more of a threat to us than a repentant offender trying to rebuild his life.
I never thought I would see the day where so many double standards exist.
not the same @Sambecks C. - I can live with the Lesbians or a Gay couple as long as they practice their lifestype in their home and in their own privacy. I don't feel it's my place(or yours) to judge them. But I can't live with a sexual preditor that is out of jail and may be on the prowl hunting little girls in my neighborhood. I want to know about that.
I find a big differnce there.
Homosexuality is not a felony.... Sexual preditor is.
Sambecks C. @Sambecks C. - Are you really going to try to lump homosexuals into the same category as pedophiles/rapists??!! By your words, they "are by far more of a threat to us than a repentant offender trying to rebuild his life". So just because someone repents for a horrendous act, they are forgiven? Most can't "rebuild" their lives seeing as a lot of sexual predators become repeat offenders. You see a homosexual more of a threat than these individuals??! I can't believe what I read...still baffles me.
Sambecks @Sambecks C. - You really have blinders on don't you? I am a heterosexual and was at this rally and did not see ANY lewd acts. Do you really think gays and lesbians are really predators?
The facts are most sexual predators against children are white males in their 20's-60's usually married to a woman.....but yet gays need to be targeted why?
Seems to me you just have so much hate in your heart or you have been brainwashed long enough not to open your eyes....sad. I feel sorry for you that you cannot see the real world.
Are You Serious Sambecks??? @Sambecks C. - You must be attempting to be funny. There absolutely can NOT be any way that you are SERIOUSLY saying that homosexuals are more of a threat than the monsters who rape, sodomize and further victimize children and women for example. "A repentant offender trying to rebuild his life" who has destroyed countless innocent lives is more acceptable to you than someone who may have never even had a parking ticket wanting to live their life as "normal" as they know it? Seriously? Are you simply a complete and utter moron or just that blinded by whatever drives your decision making process? This absolutely sickens me!
sambecks @Sambecks C. - I am a lot more worried about sick #$%@ coming after my child than a homosexual. You really need to get over it. What are you on the offenders list or something...
It's a beautiful day in this neighborhood,
A beautiful day for a neighbor.
Would you be mine?
Could you be mine?...
It's a neighborly day in this beauty wood,
A neighborly day for a beauty.
Would you be mine?
Could you be mine?...
I've always wanted to have a neighbor just like you.
I've always wanted to live in a neighborhood with you.
So, let's make the most of this beautiful day.
Since we're together we might as well say:
Would you be mine?
Could you be mine?
Won't you be my neighbor?
Won't you please,
Won't you please?
Please won't you be my neighbor?
neighbors & relatives @Chris M. - only the ones who got caught are on the sex offender list ... i'm not saying to disregard the neighbors around you ... but, also ... you need to instruct you children about wrongful touching by relatives as i beleive that uncle ural, aunt amy or father frank have better access to your children & are of the majority of abusers ... check it out; who is most likely to verbally &/or physically abuse members in your family? it is someone very close to you and probably of the same blood unfortunately. beware of sudden changes in your childs behavior after visiting
a relative or babysister ...
Exactly @marksbeaver - Unfortunately it seems that most people think the threat is from people who move into their neighborhood or whoare on this list. The fact is that 90% of victims are victimized by someone they know and it is often a relative.
We teach children to watch out for strangers, but that might not be the biggest risk. this list does little to stop children from being victimized. The best defense is loving vigilant parents who teach and watch out for their children at all times.
I signed up to receive the emails... @steven j - thought I would check to see who was in my neighborhood and wouldn't you know it? One of my neighbors (whom we have not cared to get to know) is on the offender registry list. Good thing we are moving this Saturday! Nobody within 1/4 mile of our new place. That right there is peace of mind.
Will that include foot tappers too? Those who carry the Aids virous should also be on that list. Lets not discriminate here Homosexuals should be on some kind of list as well.
The problem is most of our Courts and our Elected Officials homosexuals and most of our Elected officials would be on that list too
Interesting comment but @Blue eyes - If everyone, except to whom they were married, just kept their darn pants on, there would be nothing to worry about!
No Abortions
No AIDS
No Infidelity
No Adultry
No Teen Pregnancies
It would solve alot of problems we deal with as a society.
But hey, telling people they have to control them selves is well (fill in the blank)______________.
@Blue eyes - I have HIV and I did NOT get it from sexual relations. Your comment is nothing but pure hate. This is the kind of stuff you will have to answer for in the end.
Blue eyes - Sexual Offender Registries ....... @Blue eyes - ..... apply to convicted sex offenders only. If people don't what to be added to the list perhaps they should consider living by our laws.
I would like some real advice about this subject We are constantly bombarded by this sex offender list and I am greatful for it, however, no one ever mentions, what then are we to do with information?
If I know know that a sex offender is near by what should I do?
Do I shun them?
Do I confront them about it?
Do I keep the kids indoors?
Do I picket his house?
Do I spread the news all around?
Should I be afraid?
Some real advice by someone with some experience would be helpful.
Don't do any... @BB - It's actually a felony to harass a known sex-offender.
You can't leave posters, picket their house, confront them, etc. That is borderline vigilante-ism.
Personally, I don't agree with the lifetime membership to the offenders list. I know an offender on my own street who is doing EVERYTHING possible to right every wrong. And yet, some cowardly retard left a poster with a picture of the offender on the door that said, "You are being watched."
Can you imagine that kind of threatening for any other crime?
How about a time limit. You're on the offenders list for 1-10 years depending on severity and gravity of crime. Talk about rubbing a person's nose in the poop for a lifetime of reform.
But I have heard @Respiratory rocks - That sex offenders never recover. They are always recovering which makes them a threat forever. Isnt that correct?
@BB - The offenders that you are talking about don't use the honor system registry. We have to understand that the list in question is compiled of those offenders who are choosing to volunteer their information. Many of those on this list are not pedophiles but have been included on this list due to subjective definitions of sexual crimes. You could be placed on this list for urinating in public, sleeping with a teenager under 18 while a teenager yourself, or as in a recent case the kids who sent cell phone pics of themselves to their peers and forwarded them. The criminals we truly need to be in fear of rarely show up on the registry.
Short Sighted @Rollin S. - Sure, there are some people on the list who may have subjective charges that got caught up in the law. But to generalize as you have done and basically trivialize the many (6,000 in Utah) of them who have ruined the lives of innocent children, women and sometimes men is just ignorant. It is not a perfect system, but it is better than being in the dark. If you disagree with it, invent a better way but in the meantime don't add to the BS hype. It has saved people from being re-victimized. And if this list saves one child from further abuse, it has succeeded in my opinion.
That's a broad Brush @Nunya Bizness - Everyone is so quick to light their torches and sharpen their pitchforks that maybe the thought of reviewing each offense is out the window. I do think in some cases the list has some practical use. However, when the initial offense is reviewed in court, how about a more thorough review of the details and mental examination.
Again, scarlet letters don't fix.
Right on, Respiratory. @Respiratory rocks - Our society is getting lazier and lazier. You see it everywhere- in schools they have "zero tolerance" policies for weapons (my son was sent home for having a pair of hemostats I gave him to get the wheels out of his shoes so he'd be in compliance with the "No Heelies" rule) and for "drugs" (including acetominophen and ibuprofen).
This tendency toward broad-brush interpretations and zero tolerance policies is reflective of the lack of effort people are willing to exert to do the right thing.
I hate zero tolerance. I believe people who support it have zero common sense. We need to make the effort to get all the facts and judge accordingly, with the most righteous intent, or we are no better than the worst criminals.
(BTW, I'm an RRT for a couple of area hospitals. Where do you work?)
"urinating in public" @Rollin S. - I know a guy at 20 years old got a 15 year old girl drunk and had sex with her. The guy claims it was consensual and the girl claimed she didn’t consent; she was not the best witness as he got her so drunk that she couldn’t tell the police where they had sex.
He confessed and has a conviction but is not on the registered sex offenders list – I think your tail of urinating in public is a tall tail.
@Utah 101 - A man was drunk and urinated in a public park. Unfortunately a youth happened to see him and reported the man to his parents and he was charged with a sex crime because it happened to be in the view of a minor. He clearly shouldn't have done what he did and I am not opposed to him paying his debt for his poor decision and I am not suggesting that these are the normal grounds for those on this list but we have to be careful because we don't know the specifics. Generally though I am far more concerned with predators in my neighborhood that are not listed but are potentially around then those that are choosing to comply.
Agree and disagree @Rollin S. - I agree that we should be as (if not more) concerned about "predators in my neighborhood that are not listed"
And I completely disagree with your statement that "we don't know the specifics". We do know the specifics; in that this man had his day in court. He was given every opportunity afforded to every person in this country, as allowed by our constitution. By either a jury of his peers or a judge, duly elected to represent us, our representatives found him guilty of a crime that would place him on the sex offender’s registry. Additionally, during sentencing and through your representatives, you had the opportunity to understand the effect his actions placed on both the victim and the consequences given to the offender. Because you were not personally there doesn’t mean you have not been represented or that you don’t have access to “know the specifics” of this matter.
Rollin S - The Utah Sex Registry Isn't Based ..... @Rollin S. - ..... on the "honor system". It is a law convicted sex offenders are required to comply with. While the registry may not be perfect it is a very good step in the right direction.
@Rifleman - You may be surprised that while a requirement many do not comply. We are also required to carry auto insurance and many choose not too. We are also required to leave a buck in the bagel basket when we take one at work but many do not. We are also required to drive the posted speed limits and yet many do not. There are countless requirements that are not enforced or obeyed and frankly those that will break this particular agreement are the ones that are the most dangerous.
Sort of... @BB - The same could be said about former drug abusers, alcoholics, gamblers, pornography, and the list goes on. These other demographic groups are also "always recovering" but somehow they are not on a list for the duration of their lifetime.
You remove the 'triggers' be it the internet, movies, serving in religious callings with youth or children. There are reasonable things to help prevent relapse.
But to simply brand them with a scarlet letter does what to rehab?
Nothing. In fact it only breeds hate and hysteria.
Those that are deviant and so certified by court and mental evaluation, should have more restriction (i.e. group housing with supervision, incarceration, etc.)
But what do I know, I'm one of those Prop 8 supporters that hate anything different than myself.
What you call "hate and hysteria" @Respiratory rocks - I call health and safety for my child - please keep your convicted sex offender friend away from small children as they are more valuable than your friend or his friendship - period.
Deal. @Utah 101 - As long as you keep your alcoholic, pornographic viewing, gambling, drug abusing, angry, depressed or otherwise imperfect friends from my neighborhood too.
Oh wait, there's not a list YET for those offenses. I guess I'll just have to keep relying on the neighborhood gossip I hear about YOU and YOUR FRIENDS.
My... @Respiratory rocks - ..."alcoholic, pornographic viewing, gambling, drug abusing, angry, depressed or otherwise imperfect friends" - are not inclined to rape and kill your child.
After reading your post I'm trying to figure out who is promoting the "hate and hysteria" you are so concerned about.
I forgot @Utah 101 - They never DUI, break up homes and destroy childrens' lives with gambling, neglect, or perversions that ruin families and place bigger burdens on society. Yeah, none of those lead to any further deviant inclinations.
All I'm saying is the fence is wide and we're sure using a broad brush.
"the fence is wide" @Respiratory rocks - This is where you and I disagree - the fence is not that wide, I believe folks who are on the registered sex offenders list deserve to be there.
I know a guy at 20 years old who got a 15 year old girl drunk and had sex with her. The guy claims it was consensual and the girl claimed she didn’t consent; she was not the best witness as he got her so drunk that she couldn’t tell the police where they had sex. He confessed to a lesser charge and has a conviction for unlawful sexual contact with a minor, but is not on the registered sex offenders list
When an adult can confess to getting a 15-year old drunk, having sex with this child and still not be on the list - I don't think your fence is wide enough.
Not Fair @Utah 101 - You use ONE example that sounds like a pretty big brush to me. How about the use of alcohol in your example. Should there be a list for consuming alcohol as a minor? Afterall, she's a threat to society. She might DUI, etc. Look, did you even read my other posts? I don't condone or have a bleeding heart for these offenders. My point is that there absolutely are people on the offenders list who under mitigating circumstances don't belong there. Secondly, those who have been evaluated, penalized, re-evaluated post treatment have paid a price to be public whipping posts. Those who are most deviant likely won't care about the list, and won't do anything to correct it. Fine. Leave them there.
Here's another problem. Our courts and judicial system is so back logged with cases that there is no opportunity to sort through the individual cases.
I did read your post's... @Respiratory rocks - ...and where do I start -
Lets start with your accusation that a 15-year old girl being given booze and being raped by an adult is somehow a threat because she allowed it to happen - no wait, that's just blaming a child for the actions of an adult and really shouldn’t be commented on.
How about - you claim yet, I have not seen proof that there is anyone on the offenders list who under any circumstances don't belong there – my story (I’ve read the case file and police reports) was to point out there are indeed folks who do belong on the list, that are not. But, I have yet to be given any evidence that there is someone on the list who does not belong there (your friend is a convicted felon and you should read the police reports not take his word for it).
Lastly, “Our courts and judicial system is so back logged with cases that there is no opportunity to sort through the individual cases.” While it may take a while, I have not read anything suggesting someone has been convicted of a sexual crime and was not afforded his day in court. That would be a clear violation of our constitution and that individual’s civil rights – please provide evidence of such a case, as I would truly be interested in reading of someone in the United States who was tried and convicted without representation and having never set foot in a court room.
I'm convinced - those on this list belong there and are indeed a threat to the safety and security of our children. I am also convinced there are those who are not on this list who belong.
Here we go... @Utah 101 - My rebuff of your example regarding the 15 year old. Don't tell me a 15 year old doesn't have the sense to know that she's not supposed to be consuming alcohol. Yes, the perpetrator having confessed as you say, should be punished. What kind of atmosphere was the alcohol being given. Where was the adult supervision for a minor? Did he force the alcohol down her throat? Had she not been in a compromising situation, the assault likely might not have happened. I know, I sound absolutely self-righteous. Fine. I can sleep with that.
If the courts in general arent' backlogged, why is it that Lara Miller, in the recent past, was asking for more district attorneys to help with the jam? Nobody said that people weren't getting their day in court. But those I know personally have had less than ideal representation from court appointed defense. And don't sit there and tell me that quality don't count. Otherwise, OJ would have been locked up YEARS ago. But wait, he could afford the high price yuppy lawyers.
I am not arguing that perhaps the list isn't in someway useful. I am arguing that there are varying degrees of severity of crime that would constitute in my eyes a restitution of the crime and thus removal of one's identity from the list. Again, why the upheaval against the call for alternatives that may be more effective (i.e. group housing, more POs, better counseling with placement into society for less severe crimes, incarceration, etc.)?
You call for proof of my argument, so I will do likewise. Show me proof that the list has deterred any repeat offenders, and how it has helped those trying to resuscitate their lives.
Previous lines in this discussion have made valid statement that most offenses come at the hands of relatives and close friends. My thinking is that proper parenting, supervision and foreknowledge may help with society's impropriety. With that said, don't think I'm walking around with blinders on and don't know that there ARE the cases of blatant sexual criminal behavior. But I believe they are the exception, not the rule.
"Had SHE not been"... Wow... @Respiratory rocks - "Had she not been in a compromising situation, the assault likely might not have happened."
And had HE not been a Child Abuser and RAPED a CHILD the assault definitely would not have happened. And if people (like you) continue to blame the victim, the assaults will definitely continue to happen.
Sorry, but do NOT blame these kids for their abuse.
Here we go again... @Nunya Bizness - In regards to the example given by Utah 101, part of not being a victim is being aware of your surroundings and situation.
Nobody is saying that she's (the child)at fault for a rape. SHEESH. What I AM saying is that some efforts can be avoided in compounding an already volatile situation (i.e. consuming alcohol, illegal/prescription drug abuse, music, and natural temperment).
Yes, if he raped her and confessed and proven (cause you're still innocent until proven) he committed the crime, then punish accordingly.
I'm not blaming a victim, but I am highlighting some of the unfortunate details (i.e. supervision, alcohol consumption).
Point #1: Alcohol to be effective takes TIME to absorb and intoxicate. This clearly wasn't a grab and rape situation. Thus is some way...avoidable.
Point #2: What environment is alcohol usually given to minors? Parties, Raves, or at unsupervised homes, or at church or school? I'm only making the point that the apparent vehicle for rape in this case was alcoholic intoxication. That DOES require SOME PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY. Again, don't tell me a 15 year old doesn't know that.
Finally, Nunya, the personal attacks don't move a conversation forward. I will always back a victim FIRST as the duty and burden of proof of innocence lies on the perp.
But again, why must there be an across the board 'guilty for life' sentencing for the list?
I am sure... @BB - its like any other thing... once a smoker always a smoker... once an drug addict always a drug addict... I think the same probely goes for this they can make the strides to become better but the temptation will probley always be there... just like a smoker would stay away from cigarettes and a drug addict would stay away from drugs... Pedofiles should stay away from children... PERIOD!
Who's the DUH? @Respiratory rocks - And I quote from the sexual offenders website. Which you MUST agree to BEFORE you can enter the website:
"Pursuant to Utah code Ann. Sect. 77-27-21.5 (22)(b) and (c), members of the public are NOT allowed to use the information to harass or threaten offenders or members of their families; and harassment, stalking, or threats against offenders or their families are prohibited and doing so may violate Utah criminal laws."
Hence, the above post stating you DON'T DO ANYTHING.
So, disagree all you want. But I'm still right according to Utah state criminal laws. Unless you want to go all vigilante on someone.
What Do You Do With Knowledge... @BB - You simply become aware of your little portion of the world and use that to help protect yourself. I completely disagree with Respiratory rocks, but I do not know what their neighbor did and cannot pass judgment. But just use the offender list to be aware. If there is a child predator that lives in a certain house, watch for kids who may be going in or out. If you see them acting suspicious like watching the kids at a bus stop, do something about it. It is simply knowledge to give us power. The police do not have the resources to monitor them all, but if we empower ourselves, we could really make a difference. Be aware and stand up.
Being an advocate for Victims of Child Abuse and seeing how their lives have forever changed I have a really hard time finding any pity for someone who (example) raped a child and is having a hard time with people knowing that he raped a 10 year old little girl. Poor him. Well, no... screw him! Because that poor child has now lost their innocence forever. They will never get that back. They will never reminisce about their first experience with a boy because of the trauma.
They experience many powerful emotions as a result of abuse. They frequently blame themselves for the trauma that they have experienced and the impact that it has on their families. Victims of child abuse also experience increased anxiety and fear. This often disturbs their sleep, appetite and ability to function. A majority of the victims of child abuse experience lifelong difficulties with personal relationships. They also become easily depressed and experience a low self image with many experiencing uncontrollable anger and/or depression.
Here's some interesting stats...
! 1 in 4 girls and 1 in 6 boys are sexually abused before the age of 18
! 70% of all abuse cases involve children under the age of 10
! Utah is the 8th highest state in substantiated cases of child abuse
! For every reported case of Child Abuse, 3 more remain unreported
! In Utah alone there are over 12,000 documented cases of Child Abuse and neglect each year
! 2/3 of registered sex offenders were convicted of abuse against children
! Over 6,000 sex offenders are registered in Utah with almost 500 living in Weber County and almost 300 in Davis County
! Nationally, 36.7% of all women in prison and 14.4% of all men in prison were abused as children
! One third of abused and neglected children will later abuse their own children, continuing the horrible Chain of Abuse
Hold on... @Nunya Bizness - Don't confuse compassionate justice with ignorance.
I ABSOLUTELY concur that the victim's rights and safety take precedence over a perpetrator. With that said, it is still unlawful to harass, picket, threaten a known offender.
It is true that the police or a PO cannot follow every offender, and we do need to be aware of the goings-on in our neighborhoods, but that doesn't allow for threats, gossip and/or hearsay.
So here's the condundrum: Numerous offenders and limited resources. You can't incarcerate them all. Do we then turn and look at the idea of trying to do realistic, effective rehab with those of the least deviant offenses?
How do we fix such a problem?
The first step, IMO... @Respiratory rocks - Is the sex offender registry that so many are bashing. It gives us the ability to know, within reason, what is in our backyard. Is it perfect, no, but it is SOMETHING. And instead of living in our little bubbles, maybe we should get out there. Know our neighbors and their kids. Know what is going on around us. Because the majority of violent sex offenders, sexual predators, etc are cowards. They run from things like... knowledge and power. If we, as a society, stop relying on the unrealistic expectation that law enforcement can protect us all from everything then we will empower ourselves and actually maybe do something about what happens to us.
I am not saying we should all become vigilantes. I am saying we should stop being ignorant and co-dependent for every aspect of our lives.
Agreed. @Nunya Bizness - I agree that the answer lies within us and our neighborhoods. I would further advocate that our children be taugh by US what is considered inappropriate and deviant. That is a parent's job and a family's responsibility. Unfortunately, society relies too much on Hollywood's opinion and images portrayed by film, print, and internet to teach kids what is cool and sexually, morally, and socialogically acceptable.
Here we go again.... Look, we already know that everyone on that list has brutally raped small children...right?
Then why are they moving in next door to anyone?
If we can just keep turning the screws to these people and make it impossible for them to get a job and support their families, or unable to find a place to live and raise thier families....
Seems fair to me since everyone on the list have brutally raped small children....right?
Of course @Respiratory rocks - I am being sarcastic!!!
It is great to see that after all of this time, people are finally seing the travesty of this sex offender list.
Everyone on this list has not comitted such unbelievable acts against children, some aren't even convicted felons.
Let them live with your daughter... @allaboutthetruth - ...me, I won't risk my child’s health and safety for a convicted sex offender, not today or 10-years from now.
allaboutthetruth - Decent Society ...... @allaboutthetruth - ..... has decided to focus on the victim's rights. Convicted sex offenders must learn to live with the consequences of their actions. My sympathies are with the victims and not the sex offenders. The courts agree that sex registries are perfectly legal whether anyone likes it or not.
i got an idea !!! maybe we could put signs in their yards tooo and then we could all meet at nite with torches and sticks and round them all up...them maybe we can get a list of all those with DUI's and hunt them down too... then who else should we hunt down and kill?? i'm confused.. don't know who's next to hate... why not let GOD take care of it.... or maybe i'm just bein silllly
I would rather... @dude2960 - Go to the ridiculous extremes you stated above than not have the knowledge of where registered sex offenders are and not being able to use this knowledge tool to protect my kids and my neighbors kids. Would you want to move next door to someone who served 5 years for rape of a child and just got out 6 months ago without knowing?
I don't think you're being sillly (3 L's makes it REALLY silly) but I do think that you are being extreme and somewhat ignorant. But don't take offense, you're obviously not alone...
ur right all about..... they all musta killed their victims and buried them somewhere after brutally raping them repeatedly... i think the next law after posting where they all live is to give us the right to shot them if we see them and have a confirmed pic id that they are a sexxxx offender
The Third @Sambecks C. - There is a third type of predator.....and that is you. A predator of judgment, a predator of hate. You should be treated as such. A web-site created for small minded idiots, with automatic updates so we can know when someone like you moves into our neighborhoods, so we can protect our children from you harming them and distorting their minds.
Note - these are registered sex offenders... ...Prior to the mid 90’s sex offenders were not required to register and they still are not. There are over 100 registered sex offenders just in the avenues, and that does not include non-registered sex offenders.
What about NEW neighbors moving in and not being told or existing sex offenders living NEXT DOOR! We built a place and live their about 50% of our time between there and SLC and were not ever told by anyone that the NEXT DOOR neighbor was on the SEX OFFENDERS registry. I found it only by putting our zip in one while in the registry while working with a person from Corrections (I work in IT). The town has a huge lie going around about what happened with this guy, but it's obviously not the truth for him to be on the SEX OFFENDERS registry. Our boys use to play at their house until this person began yelling at our youngest with my husband within earshot. He went 0-60 across a 1.5 acre lot, jumped a 4' fence and was in his face. All the while not knowing about his listing on this registry. The town and surrounding neighbors should have told us or send a State of Utah formal letter notifying us of this for the safety of our children, especially since it's heard to be with related with child porn. Look it up on zip 84744.
Angel - @Angel - You have a responsibility to know what you are buying and you should have spent 10 minutes doing research on your new neighborhood prior to spending your money.
Chris M - Decent Society Has Taken The Side Of Children ....... @Chris M. - ..... and placed consequences on the behavior of sex offenders that got them convicted in the first place. Megan's Laws are here to stay.
labeling people as a "sex offender" is unconstitutional as are many of the laws that have been created regarding these so called offenses, Just like the same sex marriage proposal it's just a matter of time before someone who has the money challenges a complainant and squashes them.
I am so proud to have served my country... @gardenofwrath - and protected your right to be such an absolute moron. OK, labeling people as sex offenders is unconstitutional... really... how? Should they simply be "morally challenged"? Perhaps murderers should now be known as "Life Taking Americans". Let me guess... you're on the list?
I like to know When a wife abuser, bank robber, murderer, home robber, petty criminal, white collar criminal, jay walker, manslaughterer, speeder, conman, drunk, drug addict, forger, tax cheat, trespasser, harasser, neo-nazi, and anyone ever convicted of any misdemeanor moves my neighborhood
If its good to put one criminal on the list, it's good for all!
@boj - I think everyone has done something at some point in time that would qualify them for this. I for one should be put on the homosexual,recovering drug addict,HIV infected, dirty thought thinker, jay walker, potty-mouthed, non-Sabbath keeper, farter and belcher, family lover, do gooder,well dressed and an actual good person list.
boj - Megan's Laws Single Out Sex Offenders For A Reason @boj - Megan's laws are named for seven-year-old Megan Kanka who Jesse Timmendequas, a repeat violent sexual offender, kidnapped, raped, and murdered.
Source: Wikipedia
Megan's laws have been ruled constitutional and focus only on sex offenders. For your information boj jay walkers arn't considered as threats to the children living next door, and for that reason arn't found on sex offender lists.
People who don't want to end up on sex offenders lists need to simple behave themselves. Sounds like a fairly simple concept to me.
gardenofwrath - Megan's Laws Are On The Books In Various States Sex offenders have challenged them in court, and the courts have ruled them to be constitutional. Google is a good resource to verify my statement.
Decent society has not only the right but also the responsibility to monitor sexual predators who have committed what you have curiously described as "so called offenses".
The problem with this list.... One big problem with this list is that it helps the myth that sexual predators our strangers who snatch children off the street and you should be careful what homes o go near.
The actual facts show that 90% of all victims of sexual offenses know their attacker and the offender is most likely a member of the family.
You can put the list out all you want, but it seems those on the list are not always the ones to watch out for and this list gives a false sense of security and makes u slook in the wrong places. You must not assume your children are safe as long as they aren't at the house of someone on the list, unfortunately that is what many people think.
I agreed with you @steven j - But I don't see the fact that 90% of child abusers are related to the victim as a problem of the list. What I do see as a problem is that we have (in this country) enable the epidemic of child abuse to thrive by protecting the rights of criminals over the rights of the victims. We are also ignorant to the fact that it does happen more frequently than most people realize because we are so pre-occupied by every day life (work, football, deal or no deal, whatever) that we have lost touch of our surroundings and the increasing dangers in them. We have also lost touch with our kids for the most part.
Those on the list are definitely not always the ones to watch out for... but it's a start. The rest is up to us! So we should stop bashing the list just because it isn't perfect and doesn't solve the epidemic. That is up to us.
Both pedophilia and homosexuality are immoral acts I would like to be warned if either moves next door to me. If there is a homosexual couple and they don't tell me about what they are doing, I really don't care. My problem is when they try to convince society that what they are doing is "acceptable" That is where I draw the line.
What is my deal with homosexuals? As little as possible @Kimmy - My issue is when they try to make evil good. My issue is when they continuously try to shove this sick agenda down our throats, threaten our religious freedom to uphold our moral standards. No, I'm in this fight for the long haul. Those who have been silently supporting proposition 8, will now become very vocal about it.
Both pedophile and homoesexual activists are predators to society and they should be treated as such.
Sambecks @Sambecks C. - There is a huge difference between homosexuals and sexual predators. Predators go after those who do not or cannot consent. Homosexuals mind their own business and do not force themselves on anyone else. So WHY do you feel the need to drag them through the mud on these stories that have nothing to do with them? Like I said, let it go. If you can't, you might want to talk to a therapist.
If homosexuals minded their own business, there would be no gay pride parades @Kimmy - or trying to force the rest of us to accept their lifestyle as normal when it is not.
Infact, if homosexuals wanted to do anything, they would just shut up!!!
@Sambecks C. - I would like to be informed when someone like you moves into my neighboorhood. I would rather not surround myself with biggotist morons.
I'll be sure not to purchase a home in Sodam and Gomorrah @Chris M. - Because I don't tolerate homosexual activists, I'm considere homophobic and a bigot. So be it!!! I don't hate homosexuals, only their sick agenda.
Like I said, If they want go do henious act in the closet, I really don't want to know about it @Chris M. - That is my whole issue with them. I will never condon or support their henious lifestyle. I am willing to compromise with "Don't ask, Don't tell" More than that, then they deserve what they get.
@Sambecks C. - Well then, why are you so proactive in putting gays down and support legislation that denies them equal rights. Why do you feel the need to discriminate against them and why are you pushing to put them on a registry list? There are religions you don't agree with, and people with other views than you own you don't agree with, yet you are not crusading to single them out. Why the gays? What did the gays do to you? Ir are you just jealous and hurt because the gays won't do anything to you. You, my friend are nothing but contridictions, hateful ones at best.
Promoting a false sense of security Really, what do people hope to get out of this? You should be equally careful no matter who lives near you or how safe you think your neighborhood is. Anyone could be a predator who just hasn't been caught. Don't judge a book by its cover and don't assume you're safe just because you live in a "perfect" suburban neighborhood. Be smart and don't let your guard down for any reason.
your neighbor? i registered just so i knew who was living by me and just so i could know just how safe my child is outside or how safe i am outside!!! there are 12 of them in my neighborhood. should i be afraid? NO but i will take curtain precautions to keep me and my child safe. at least you know who to stay away from. i would rather know than be clueless about it...and for the person BB that was writing about teen pregnancies you can bite me cause i had my child at 18 im married and have a happy life so dont hate on teen pregnancies cause no matter what you say people are going to get pregnant and live there life no one cares what you have to say. it all depends on how matture you are and if your stabel enough to have kids and trust me i know many people that shouldnt have. i can see it would be wrong if like a 12 or 15 year old got prego but i was married and everything before i had mine so dont judge
I think... I think the whole registry list is really stupid!
I do understand this is to help out our society but what about making a list for all the murderers, robbers, drug addicts, people who get DUI and everyone else who has been convicted of a crime? I mean it would be a benefit to our society wouldn't it?
I mean we hear about the stories of our children as young as 14 being addicted to drugs. Maybe if we knew there were drug dealers living in our neighborhood we could keep our children away.
It would also be beneficial to know your neighbors are robbers to keep your doors locked etc.
I think the sex offenders list is really cruel and unusual punishment! They are people too!
mytwocentsworth - Sex Registries Become ........ ...... a lot easier to understand when you understand how they orginated. Wikipedia details Megan's Law in great detail and explains who Megan Kanka was. The article also describes a repeat violent sexual offender by the name of Jesse Timmendequas who kidnapped, raped, and murdered Megan.
The courts have ruled, mytwocentsworth, that Megan's right to life trumped Mr. Timmendequas's right to quietly wait for an opportunity to rape and kill her.
Being placed on a sexual offender registration list is not a punishment by a consequence of criminal sexual offenses which an individual has been convicted of.
If parents spent as much time really supervising their kids... as they spend tracking these creeps on the internet, there wouldn't be any need for this program.
Janine Gardner - In A Perfect World People ........ ..... wouldn't have to lock their car doors or guard their children against sexual predators. This, however, is not a perfect world and decent society has decided that we have the right and responsibility to track convicted sex offenders just like you would a rattlesnake or wolf.
My sympathies, Janine, are with children like Megan Kanka and not with the man who raped and murdered her. Sex registries are a fact of life whether some people like it or not.
why don't they just post their emails so the offends can email them, tell them they are in town and talk about it, in fact if they want to know so bad give them their own phone numbers, and if they got a buddy in prison give them theirs too, that way everyone is on the same page!
gardenofwrath - That Is A Question Best Asked ........ @gardenofwrath - ...... of children who have been sexually abused. Thing is, gardenofwrath, I'm not quite sure why anyone would want an abused child on the same page with the individual convicted of the abuse.
There are life long consequences for both the victim as well as the convicted felon. The courts have reviewed sex registries and found them to be quite legal.
Living in fear The recividism rate for a convicted sex offender is very low. Most people on this list made a mistake, have paid for their mistake, and are trying to move on with their lives. The fact that we as a society keep rubbing it in their noses says that we are unable to forgive. These people are set up to fail. They are branded for a lifetime of hatred. I believe in keeping our children safe, but that needs to come from education at home not fear of all your neighbors.
mustang72 - Sex Offender Registrations (Megan's Laws) ....... @mustang72 - ...... arn't designed to rub a convicted sex offender's nose in it. They also have nothing to do with forgiveness or hatrid. They are designed to serve one purpose and one purpose only. That purpose is to protect children.
Megan's Laws in various states were set up in response to the rape and murder of Megan Kanka by a repeat violent sex offender by the name of Jesse Timmendequas.
Source:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megan's_Law
Decent society, mustang72, has decided that it appropriate to keep track of individuals who have been covicted of sex crimes. Hate, forgiveness and punishment don't even enter the equation.
People on the Utah State Sex Registry have all been convicted of sex crimes not sex mistakes. Your comment almost makes it sound like you have a personal problem with sex offender registries.
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I never thought I would see the day where so many double standards exist.
I find a big differnce there.
Homosexuality is not a felony.... Sexual preditor is.
The facts are most sexual predators against children are white males in their 20's-60's usually married to a woman.....but yet gays need to be targeted why?
Seems to me you just have so much hate in your heart or you have been brainwashed long enough not to open your eyes....sad. I feel sorry for you that you cannot see the real world.
Again, where is the idiot button so we can all give Sambecks our vote??
A beautiful day for a neighbor.
Would you be mine?
Could you be mine?...
It's a neighborly day in this beauty wood,
A neighborly day for a beauty.
Would you be mine?
Could you be mine?...
I've always wanted to have a neighbor just like you.
I've always wanted to live in a neighborhood with you.
So, let's make the most of this beautiful day.
Since we're together we might as well say:
Would you be mine?
Could you be mine?
Won't you be my neighbor?
Won't you please,
Won't you please?
Please won't you be my neighbor?
a relative or babysister ...
We teach children to watch out for strangers, but that might not be the biggest risk. this list does little to stop children from being victimized. The best defense is loving vigilant parents who teach and watch out for their children at all times.
If a family member is convicted of a sex crime he/she goes on the list just like the sexual deviate living down the block.
The problem is most of our Courts and our Elected Officials homosexuals and most of our Elected officials would be on that list too
No Abortions
No AIDS
No Infidelity
No Adultry
No Teen Pregnancies
It would solve alot of problems we deal with as a society.
But hey, telling people they have to control them selves is well (fill in the blank)______________.
If I know know that a sex offender is near by what should I do?
Do I shun them?
Do I confront them about it?
Do I keep the kids indoors?
Do I picket his house?
Do I spread the news all around?
Should I be afraid?
Some real advice by someone with some experience would be helpful.
You can't leave posters, picket their house, confront them, etc. That is borderline vigilante-ism.
Personally, I don't agree with the lifetime membership to the offenders list. I know an offender on my own street who is doing EVERYTHING possible to right every wrong. And yet, some cowardly retard left a poster with a picture of the offender on the door that said, "You are being watched."
Can you imagine that kind of threatening for any other crime?
How about a time limit. You're on the offenders list for 1-10 years depending on severity and gravity of crime. Talk about rubbing a person's nose in the poop for a lifetime of reform.
Again, scarlet letters don't fix.
This tendency toward broad-brush interpretations and zero tolerance policies is reflective of the lack of effort people are willing to exert to do the right thing.
I hate zero tolerance. I believe people who support it have zero common sense. We need to make the effort to get all the facts and judge accordingly, with the most righteous intent, or we are no better than the worst criminals.
(BTW, I'm an RRT for a couple of area hospitals. Where do you work?)
How about you?
He confessed and has a conviction but is not on the registered sex offenders list – I think your tail of urinating in public is a tall tail.
And I completely disagree with your statement that "we don't know the specifics". We do know the specifics; in that this man had his day in court. He was given every opportunity afforded to every person in this country, as allowed by our constitution. By either a jury of his peers or a judge, duly elected to represent us, our representatives found him guilty of a crime that would place him on the sex offender’s registry. Additionally, during sentencing and through your representatives, you had the opportunity to understand the effect his actions placed on both the victim and the consequences given to the offender. Because you were not personally there doesn’t mean you have not been represented or that you don’t have access to “know the specifics” of this matter.
You remove the 'triggers' be it the internet, movies, serving in religious callings with youth or children. There are reasonable things to help prevent relapse.
But to simply brand them with a scarlet letter does what to rehab?
Nothing. In fact it only breeds hate and hysteria.
Those that are deviant and so certified by court and mental evaluation, should have more restriction (i.e. group housing with supervision, incarceration, etc.)
But what do I know, I'm one of those Prop 8 supporters that hate anything different than myself.
Oh wait, there's not a list YET for those offenses. I guess I'll just have to keep relying on the neighborhood gossip I hear about YOU and YOUR FRIENDS.
After reading your post I'm trying to figure out who is promoting the "hate and hysteria" you are so concerned about.
All I'm saying is the fence is wide and we're sure using a broad brush.
I know a guy at 20 years old who got a 15 year old girl drunk and had sex with her. The guy claims it was consensual and the girl claimed she didn’t consent; she was not the best witness as he got her so drunk that she couldn’t tell the police where they had sex. He confessed to a lesser charge and has a conviction for unlawful sexual contact with a minor, but is not on the registered sex offenders list
When an adult can confess to getting a 15-year old drunk, having sex with this child and still not be on the list - I don't think your fence is wide enough.
Here's another problem. Our courts and judicial system is so back logged with cases that there is no opportunity to sort through the individual cases.
Lets start with your accusation that a 15-year old girl being given booze and being raped by an adult is somehow a threat because she allowed it to happen - no wait, that's just blaming a child for the actions of an adult and really shouldn’t be commented on.
How about - you claim yet, I have not seen proof that there is anyone on the offenders list who under any circumstances don't belong there – my story (I’ve read the case file and police reports) was to point out there are indeed folks who do belong on the list, that are not. But, I have yet to be given any evidence that there is someone on the list who does not belong there (your friend is a convicted felon and you should read the police reports not take his word for it).
Lastly, “Our courts and judicial system is so back logged with cases that there is no opportunity to sort through the individual cases.” While it may take a while, I have not read anything suggesting someone has been convicted of a sexual crime and was not afforded his day in court. That would be a clear violation of our constitution and that individual’s civil rights – please provide evidence of such a case, as I would truly be interested in reading of someone in the United States who was tried and convicted without representation and having never set foot in a court room.
I'm convinced - those on this list belong there and are indeed a threat to the safety and security of our children. I am also convinced there are those who are not on this list who belong.
If the courts in general arent' backlogged, why is it that Lara Miller, in the recent past, was asking for more district attorneys to help with the jam? Nobody said that people weren't getting their day in court. But those I know personally have had less than ideal representation from court appointed defense. And don't sit there and tell me that quality don't count. Otherwise, OJ would have been locked up YEARS ago. But wait, he could afford the high price yuppy lawyers.
I am not arguing that perhaps the list isn't in someway useful. I am arguing that there are varying degrees of severity of crime that would constitute in my eyes a restitution of the crime and thus removal of one's identity from the list. Again, why the upheaval against the call for alternatives that may be more effective (i.e. group housing, more POs, better counseling with placement into society for less severe crimes, incarceration, etc.)?
You call for proof of my argument, so I will do likewise. Show me proof that the list has deterred any repeat offenders, and how it has helped those trying to resuscitate their lives.
Previous lines in this discussion have made valid statement that most offenses come at the hands of relatives and close friends. My thinking is that proper parenting, supervision and foreknowledge may help with society's impropriety. With that said, don't think I'm walking around with blinders on and don't know that there ARE the cases of blatant sexual criminal behavior. But I believe they are the exception, not the rule.
And had HE not been a Child Abuser and RAPED a CHILD the assault definitely would not have happened. And if people (like you) continue to blame the victim, the assaults will definitely continue to happen.
Sorry, but do NOT blame these kids for their abuse.
Nobody is saying that she's (the child)at fault for a rape. SHEESH. What I AM saying is that some efforts can be avoided in compounding an already volatile situation (i.e. consuming alcohol, illegal/prescription drug abuse, music, and natural temperment).
Yes, if he raped her and confessed and proven (cause you're still innocent until proven) he committed the crime, then punish accordingly.
I'm not blaming a victim, but I am highlighting some of the unfortunate details (i.e. supervision, alcohol consumption).
Point #1: Alcohol to be effective takes TIME to absorb and intoxicate. This clearly wasn't a grab and rape situation. Thus is some way...avoidable.
Point #2: What environment is alcohol usually given to minors? Parties, Raves, or at unsupervised homes, or at church or school? I'm only making the point that the apparent vehicle for rape in this case was alcoholic intoxication. That DOES require SOME PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY. Again, don't tell me a 15 year old doesn't know that.
Finally, Nunya, the personal attacks don't move a conversation forward. I will always back a victim FIRST as the duty and burden of proof of innocence lies on the perp.
But again, why must there be an across the board 'guilty for life' sentencing for the list?
"Pursuant to Utah code Ann. Sect. 77-27-21.5 (22)(b) and (c), members of the public are NOT allowed to use the information to harass or threaten offenders or members of their families; and harassment, stalking, or threats against offenders or their families are prohibited and doing so may violate Utah criminal laws."
Hence, the above post stating you DON'T DO ANYTHING.
So, disagree all you want. But I'm still right according to Utah state criminal laws. Unless you want to go all vigilante on someone.
Being an advocate for Victims of Child Abuse and seeing how their lives have forever changed I have a really hard time finding any pity for someone who (example) raped a child and is having a hard time with people knowing that he raped a 10 year old little girl. Poor him. Well, no... screw him! Because that poor child has now lost their innocence forever. They will never get that back. They will never reminisce about their first experience with a boy because of the trauma.
They experience many powerful emotions as a result of abuse. They frequently blame themselves for the trauma that they have experienced and the impact that it has on their families. Victims of child abuse also experience increased anxiety and fear. This often disturbs their sleep, appetite and ability to function. A majority of the victims of child abuse experience lifelong difficulties with personal relationships. They also become easily depressed and experience a low self image with many experiencing uncontrollable anger and/or depression.
Here's some interesting stats...
! 1 in 4 girls and 1 in 6 boys are sexually abused before the age of 18
! 70% of all abuse cases involve children under the age of 10
! Utah is the 8th highest state in substantiated cases of child abuse
! For every reported case of Child Abuse, 3 more remain unreported
! In Utah alone there are over 12,000 documented cases of Child Abuse and neglect each year
! 2/3 of registered sex offenders were convicted of abuse against children
! Over 6,000 sex offenders are registered in Utah with almost 500 living in Weber County and almost 300 in Davis County
! Nationally, 36.7% of all women in prison and 14.4% of all men in prison were abused as children
! One third of abused and neglected children will later abuse their own children, continuing the horrible Chain of Abuse
Stepping off of my soapbox now.
I ABSOLUTELY concur that the victim's rights and safety take precedence over a perpetrator. With that said, it is still unlawful to harass, picket, threaten a known offender.
It is true that the police or a PO cannot follow every offender, and we do need to be aware of the goings-on in our neighborhoods, but that doesn't allow for threats, gossip and/or hearsay.
So here's the condundrum: Numerous offenders and limited resources. You can't incarcerate them all. Do we then turn and look at the idea of trying to do realistic, effective rehab with those of the least deviant offenses?
How do we fix such a problem?
I am not saying we should all become vigilantes. I am saying we should stop being ignorant and co-dependent for every aspect of our lives.
Then why are they moving in next door to anyone?
If we can just keep turning the screws to these people and make it impossible for them to get a job and support their families, or unable to find a place to live and raise thier families....
Seems fair to me since everyone on the list have brutally raped small children....right?
It is great to see that after all of this time, people are finally seing the travesty of this sex offender list.
Everyone on this list has not comitted such unbelievable acts against children, some aren't even convicted felons.
I don't think you're being sillly (3 L's makes it REALLY silly) but I do think that you are being extreme and somewhat ignorant. But don't take offense, you're obviously not alone...
Pedophiles also harm and distort children's minds.
Neither of the two types of predators are examples I would want my kids to follow.
Anyone teaching and/or practicing sex outside of marriage is a predator to society and should be treated as such.
The only one with a distorted mind is you.
If its good to put one criminal on the list, it's good for all!
Source: Wikipedia
Megan's laws have been ruled constitutional and focus only on sex offenders. For your information boj jay walkers arn't considered as threats to the children living next door, and for that reason arn't found on sex offender lists.
People who don't want to end up on sex offenders lists need to simple behave themselves. Sounds like a fairly simple concept to me.
Decent society has not only the right but also the responsibility to monitor sexual predators who have committed what you have curiously described as "so called offenses".
The actual facts show that 90% of all victims of sexual offenses know their attacker and the offender is most likely a member of the family.
You can put the list out all you want, but it seems those on the list are not always the ones to watch out for and this list gives a false sense of security and makes u slook in the wrong places. You must not assume your children are safe as long as they aren't at the house of someone on the list, unfortunately that is what many people think.
Those on the list are definitely not always the ones to watch out for... but it's a start. The rest is up to us! So we should stop bashing the list just because it isn't perfect and doesn't solve the epidemic. That is up to us.
Both pedophile and homoesexual activists are predators to society and they should be treated as such.
Infact, if homosexuals wanted to do anything, they would just shut up!!!
I do understand this is to help out our society but what about making a list for all the murderers, robbers, drug addicts, people who get DUI and everyone else who has been convicted of a crime? I mean it would be a benefit to our society wouldn't it?
I mean we hear about the stories of our children as young as 14 being addicted to drugs. Maybe if we knew there were drug dealers living in our neighborhood we could keep our children away.
It would also be beneficial to know your neighbors are robbers to keep your doors locked etc.
I think the sex offenders list is really cruel and unusual punishment! They are people too!
The courts have ruled, mytwocentsworth, that Megan's right to life trumped Mr. Timmendequas's right to quietly wait for an opportunity to rape and kill her.
Being placed on a sexual offender registration list is not a punishment by a consequence of criminal sexual offenses which an individual has been convicted of.
My sympathies, Janine, are with children like Megan Kanka and not with the man who raped and murdered her. Sex registries are a fact of life whether some people like it or not.
There are life long consequences for both the victim as well as the convicted felon. The courts have reviewed sex registries and found them to be quite legal.
Megan's Laws in various states were set up in response to the rape and murder of Megan Kanka by a repeat violent sex offender by the name of Jesse Timmendequas.
Source:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megan's_Law
Decent society, mustang72, has decided that it appropriate to keep track of individuals who have been covicted of sex crimes. Hate, forgiveness and punishment don't even enter the equation.
People on the Utah State Sex Registry have all been convicted of sex crimes not sex mistakes. Your comment almost makes it sound like you have a personal problem with sex offender registries.